Rallye S1 MA5 20CB90 problem

Robitzoo · 12-02-2018, 07:23 AM

Hello guys,
Im Robert from Romania and I own a 1993 106 Rallye S1 with 123000km on the clock. I bought the car quite cheap few months ago and I need to fix a few things. Apart from some idle problems the main would be the gearbox which started jumping out of second gear when turning left without stepping on the gas. I adapted quite fast to that left foot braking on corers, wich seemed to work. I knew Its not a fix but it worked for a while. I really taught its an engine mount problem... After a while it started jumping out of second no matter what and it wont stay in gear even if I hold the gear lever with my hand.
So I opened the box with a friend and started looking for the problem. As suspected second gear looks quite bad so the only thing I can think about its to find another box and swap the internals. I really want to keep the car as original as possible so swapping to a different gearbox wouldn't be an option.

Its very difficult to find a 20cb90 gearbox around here so I am wondering if someone around here knows which gearboxes I could find to be able to swap second gear from. Second gear ratio and teeth needs to be 1.95 20x39.
Quite easy to find a gearbox from 1.1, 1.4 [ not xsi ] but I dont know anything about the ratios on those ones and if they would fit in my box.

I really hope to find an answer around here and Im really excited to find such a big comunity of Rallye owners.

Cheers !

**Peo** · 12-02-2018, 01:46 PM

Any sport gearbox Will do
1.6 rallye
1.6 gti
1.6 vts 16v
1.6 vtr 1.6 8v
All same internals, different Crown wheel

Robitzoo · 12-02-2018, 04:58 PM

Well thank you, that makes it easier !
Sadly I couldn't find any of those by now in my country.. Everyone seems to sell boxes from 1.0 / 1.1 / 1.4 Saxo..
I checked on the internet for those Saxo gearboxses and they seem to have same ratios as the rallye. Only final drive seems to be different. Does anyone know if that is true and if I can swap second gear from one of those ?

**welshpug** · 12-02-2018, 05:44 PM

are you sure its the gear not the synchro ring and spring?

Robitzoo · 12-02-2018, 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by welshpug

are you sure its the gear not the synchro ring and spring?

Im not sure. I have no experience with gearboxes and I really wish I had. Well, might be a start for that right now. My neighbour who helped me open the gearbox said its not just the synchro.. He opened a few gearboxes before and he seems to be experienced.
I will post a link to a picture I took last night when I opened the box, if helps by any chance.

https://ibb.co/dQpSt7

**welshpug** · 12-02-2018, 07:01 PM

I can't see anything wrong in that picture.

Robitzoo · 12-02-2018, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by welshpug

I can't see anything wrong in that picture.

Well. neighbor said the thiner ring under the big wheel Im having my finger on its the problem and the teeth are in bad shape. Wich I guess looks a little peculiar ?

I was wondering If I can find something like that new.. maybe in the local Peugeot dealer.
Second option would be to fit one from a 1.0 / 1.1 / 1.4 ... Some of these gearboxes seem to have same ratios as mine.. I can find these for sale around here. Sadly no xsi,rallye or gti boxes..
What do u think?

Mendez · 27-02-2018, 05:27 PM

Hello

the gearboxes are the same / identical between the Saxo Cup 16v / 106 GTI 16v, Rallye 1.6 8v ... etc. the difference is that it changes from 13.59 (rallye mk1) to the Gti / Cup 16v which is 16.63, or AX GTI 14.60. All the rest is the same.

Try to change the sinc from the 2nd gear... its a cheap fix.

**drmo** · 04-07-2018, 11:17 AM

worn out teeth on the synchro rings don't make the gears to pop out. Most of the time these teeth are worn because of worn inside of the synchro ring which stops the gear spinning.

You probably have worn out whole synchro assembly. Hope you understand what I mean as I don't know the correct word for it.

12-02-2018, 07:23 AM	#1
Robitzoo REGISTERED FORUM USER - NON MEMBER Join Date: Feb 2018 Location: Romania Posts: 4	Rallye S1 MA5 20CB90 problem Hello guys, Im Robert from Romania and I own a 1993 106 Rallye S1 with 123000km on the clock. I bought the car quite cheap few months ago and I need to fix a few things. Apart from some idle problems the main would be the gearbox which started jumping out of second gear when turning left without stepping on the gas. I adapted quite fast to that left foot braking on corers, wich seemed to work. I knew Its not a fix but it worked for a while. I really taught its an engine mount problem... After a while it started jumping out of second no matter what and it wont stay in gear even if I hold the gear lever with my hand. So I opened the box with a friend and started looking for the problem. As suspected second gear looks quite bad so the only thing I can think about its to find another box and swap the internals. I really want to keep the car as original as possible so swapping to a different gearbox wouldn't be an option. Its very difficult to find a 20cb90 gearbox around here so I am wondering if someone around here knows which gearboxes I could find to be able to swap second gear from. Second gear ratio and teeth needs to be 1.95 20x39. Quite easy to find a gearbox from 1.1, 1.4 [ not xsi ] but I dont know anything about the ratios on those ones and if they would fit in my box. I really hope to find an answer around here and Im really excited to find such a big comunity of Rallye owners. Cheers !

04-07-2018, 11:17 AM	#9
drmo 106 RALLYE REGISTER MEMBER Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Slovenia Posts: 805	worn out teeth on the synchro rings don't make the gears to pop out. Most of the time these teeth are worn because of worn inside of the synchro ring which stops the gear spinning. You probably have worn out whole synchro assembly. Hope you understand what I mean as I don't know the correct word for it. __________________ my project thread: -->Click!<--

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12-02-2018, 01:46 PM	#2
Peo 106 RALLYE REGISTER MEMBER Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: Denmark Posts: 17	Any sport gearbox Will do 1.6 rallye 1.6 gti 1.6 vts 16v 1.6 vtr 1.6 8v All same internals, different Crown wheel

12-02-2018, 04:58 PM	#3
Robitzoo REGISTERED FORUM USER - NON MEMBER Join Date: Feb 2018 Location: Romania Posts: 4	Well thank you, that makes it easier ! Sadly I couldn't find any of those by now in my country.. Everyone seems to sell boxes from 1.0 / 1.1 / 1.4 Saxo.. I checked on the internet for those Saxo gearboxses and they seem to have same ratios as the rallye. Only final drive seems to be different. Does anyone know if that is true and if I can swap second gear from one of those ?

12-02-2018, 05:44 PM	#4
welshpug 106 RALLYE REGISTER MEMBER Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: cwmcarn Posts: 4,913	are you sure its the gear not the synchro ring and spring?

12-02-2018, 07:01 PM	#6
welshpug 106 RALLYE REGISTER MEMBER Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: cwmcarn Posts: 4,913	I can't see anything wrong in that picture.

27-02-2018, 05:27 PM	#8
Mendez REGISTERED FORUM USER - NON MEMBER Join Date: May 2017 Location: Amadora Posts: 30	Hello the gearboxes are the same / identical between the Saxo Cup 16v / 106 GTI 16v, Rallye 1.6 8v ... etc. the difference is that it changes from 13.59 (rallye mk1) to the Gti / Cup 16v which is 16.63, or AX GTI 14.60. All the rest is the same. Try to change the sinc from the 2nd gear... its a cheap fix.